The Formula
Chapter: Season Four
I could do an entire second comic with just Pops and Larry’s adventures in debauchery. Actually, that’s what I would call the comic: Adventures in Debauchery
I like to think that Sam is maturing and developing noticeably as a character and a lot of folks ask about his trials with Larry. Don’t worry, that thread is coming back around soon, but I have a few things I’d like to do first (such as an arc that focuses on Trevor and Charlie).
The Karthun story (and the group’s adventures) continue on Friday!
I greatly prefer rule-of-cool games to pissy rules lawyers like Brett. Grats, you made me want to smack a cartoon. XD
This!
I like everything I’ve read of this world, whacky crit powers included.
Exactly. Which is why I prefer to start folks, or play games where it is assume, folks already have some measure of experience already.
Old post, yes, but I had to say it;
In one of the campaigns I participated in, I played an experienced Mage-Lord hired to protect and guide the son of a very powerful noble. The character never really “leveled up” so much as started trying a little harder. The DM was pretty good and gave everyone a chance to shine; Mine was when he threw in a few literally impossible to escape situations that I was allowed to blast a path out of as if I was a significantly higher level, and once during a very large scale battle.
Ah, bit of clarification, the noble son was another of the PCs
Same here. I (and by extension Sam) much rather prefer what is cool as opposed to what is by the letter. I often reward ballsy, “will this look cool” players.
Same here. One of the best ways to milk a campaign of mine for all it’s worth is to take the Badass Option whenever possible.
Rule of Cool, Ballsy But Stupid Award, and others are just some of my favorite things
Had a quick pickup game with rules based vaguely on rolling a single d4, 6, 8, or of course, 20. Highlights follow.
The Gay Fairy King turned and settled down with the orc king (NPC) to raise a horde of young, newly orphaned orcs (moral: PCs are horrible people)
The Neckbeard Pornstar came through on his promise of “pruning” a community of dryads.
The Wisecracking Gunslinger settled down with the Princess (NPC).
The Fire Mage of Fire and the Alcoholic Elf created a vodka-based explosion which annihilated everyone else, including the king of the realm (NPC).
Our DM drank damn-near an entire bottle of rum over our retardation.
tl;dr: Rule of Cool trumps “official rules of official progression through official worldtype, officially.”
Edit: Risus
“Our DM drank damn-near an entire bottle of rum over our retardation.”
Holyfuckwhat?! I did the same thing when the party I DM for started murdering gods. My idea of taking “a shot whenever something stupid-ridiculous” happen backfired spectacularly. Although Rum IS delicious, so I cannot complain that much.
Rule of Cool=more important than rule 0
panel 5 t-shirt comes out when?
I want that shirt sooo bad!
yeah i would have dropped the “hammer of god” on Brett by panel 4 and told him not to come back until he puts on his big boy pants and grows the hell up. Rule number one of any gaming session, “do not piss off the DM” the only exception is if you really want to reroll. many times.
Well done Sam. I’ve had to deal with a similar argument from the occasional player in a homebrew game I run now and then, and I’ve gotten to the point where I tell them that if they don’t like it, they can find another game, since everyone else is having fun.
Also, I would totally read Adventures in Debauchery. Can’t get enough of Pops and Larry.
He doesn’t really nit-pick about rules or game balance (where he can makes a valid point, sometime) he’s basically complaining about the lack of clichés. It’s worse than being a a rules lawyer.
(and maybe goblins don’t even exist in this world.)
Alright, at this point Sam has every right to tell Brett to get the hell out of his house and never come back. I don’t care who you are, you don’t take that big of a shit on a friend’s hard work just because it’s different than what you’re used to. Remember, Brett: if people didn’t try to shake things up with their games, there wouldn’t even BE a D&D.
Must… have… Larry’s… shirt!!
If demand is there. Maybe. We’ll see.
Panel 5 would make a far superior t-shirt, I feel.
I’ll buy TWO. That’s a lot of demand, right? :p
Quick typo report: First panel should be “as serious as a pregnancy test”, not “a serious as”.
POPS!
That guy….love that guy.
Also…I love the fact that Pops and Larry have glitter on them….
Immersion level: 10.
see, i wouldn’t be so melodramatic as sam. i’d simply let him wind down, then tell him to leave the table and not come back till he’d opened his mind to other styles of play.
I wish to kickstart your Adventures in Debauchery.
Also, I’d love to fund that comic idea.
Psshhh. Goblins and Orcs at low levels?? How droll. First campaign I ran the party took on human and ogre gangsters, so that they could gain control the black markets.
From what I’ve experienced, non-traditional games are more fun. Why take down the Dark Lord Whatsisface and do mindless dungeon-crawling to build up to that level of power when you could fire a Thompson Repeating Crossbow into the rival mob while shipping your illegal magically-created booze to your dealers instead?? Epicness Trumps Standard and Expected.
That…is..So..metal. And by metal I mean AWESOME.
sir, i would sit down to a pickup game run by you any day of the week.
Wow, Brett whines a lot. Personally, I’d throw someone like that out of my group. Gaming is supposed to be fun and people like that try to ruin it for everyone. They are the worst.
Tangential comment first: “Thrift store hat sale” = EPIC SLAM
More serious comment. I think Brett’s issue goes beyond simple rules lawyering. Brett’s an experienced player, and he knows how to metagame a traditional RPG. Think of the guy who refuses to approach a rust monster even though there is no reason to believe his character would know the effect of tangling with one. He’s actually trying to “win” the game. In Sam’s campaign world, Brett can’t fall back on his gaming knowledge of one type of campaign, and he’ll actually have to make an effort to “win.” I’ve played with this type of person before. They start out with a backlash like we see here, but then they become a bunch of (very annoying) nervous ninnies because they don’t know how to expect the unexpected and they think every little detail might be their doom.
I got a guy like that in my group. I hate that guy.
they’re so fun to mess with as a DM. you just start throwing little things at them all the time until they’re a paranoid mess.
and then you give them surprise AWESOME thing like a party or a guy comes out of nowhere to give them a prize or a huge bag of gold but they flip out and shank him and then they’re in the stocks for murder.
why yes i do punk my players constantly…
As a fan of Exalted, I can say that Sam’s game sounds awesome.
As a gamer who is playing Exalted, Word.
Greyhawk is about as “old school” D&D as you get.
I could go back to 2nd Edition and bring up game worlds like Birthright, Dark Sun and Planescape. Hell, in Birthright you got to had your own kingdom as a 1st level character.
Brett should be given the choice of playing what Sam has worked so hard to create without being a whiny ass or shown the door and told he can come back when he’s ready to be an adult.
Not quite. Going by publication dates (I’m assuming we’re not counting those lucky enough to actually play with the setting creators) Blackmoor beat Greyhawk by five years.
Uh-oh..UH-OH!! You done fucked up Brett! You called down the THUNDER! The sam thunder..the samder?
Ether way I do get where Brett is coming from. I really do. I railed against 4th edition when it came out and before that I made mystical signs in the air and warded my bookshelf with garlic against eberron for 3.5.
Surprise, turns out both of these things and many other things about D&D I never tried turned out to be awesome. But we gamers..and in particular 2nd edition and older players..tend to be creatures of habit. I’m not defending his behavior,just explaining that his attitude is not entirely unsubstantiated.
Sometimes new things are scary. Most of the time their awesome if we give them a try.
Except for Psionics. That mechanic can go jump of a bridge.
i had a player insist on creating a psion character. i countered with werewolves on raptor-back armed with lightsabers and m-60s backed up by gnomes armed with RPG-7s.
My players fear it when I bring out the orcs and goblins, since both are incredibly dangerous groups to have to deal with in my settings. Same for Zombies, Skeletons, and other typical low level fodder. The reason? There are never just a few of any of them and something is always behind them. Goblins are let by Hobgoblins who are insanely powerful. Orcs are just orcs, but they level like PCs and come in huge armies. Skeletons and Zombies mean demons or summoners or unholiness.
I typically have the PCs have to deal with thieves, brigands, tough but isolated monsters, large spiders or rats, or other pests if I start a game at level 1.
Brett is a tool.
I have just spent my entire working day going through every single comic and I must say i am in love! I’m a little bit of a girl-gamer myself, but this has really got me motivated to get into D&D – I kinda wanted to years ago but never did! And now YAY i have a new webcomic to follow. Thanks for such awesome work 🙂
Hey, thank you! That is always nice to hear and I am happy you’re enjoying the comic. As for D&D: YES. TRY IT! I believe everyone should give it a try at least once. My advice: Keep it simple to start. Roll up a fighter and wade in.
If you do try, I would love to hear how it goes.
Do you hear that clanging sound? That be the sound of Sam’s GM-balls dropping.
Speaking on behalf of beleaguered DMs everywhere who have had to deal with this sort of BS from players, I want to see Sam rip Brett a new one and reduce him to a quivering, sobbing pile before delivering the ultimate ultimatum: That Brett either plays the game the way Sam runs it or he better not let the door hit his ass on the way out.
Just binged your entire archive and I have to say this is one of my new favorites. Haven’t played a tabletop RPG since high school (in my 30s now) but this makes me want to jump back in. Well done!
YES! Thank you! The ONLY way to answer that. Sounding more and more like Brett is afraid to step out of his gaming comfort zone and expresses that by trying to control every game he plays. I’m running a campaign in a homebrew world right now and I have some awesome players, and this arc makes me more grateful for them. Also gives me some ideas…
Amazing job, as always.
I hate to say it…but I kind of agree with Brett here. Now, don’t get me wrong, I’m not advocating boring, stale drudges through grey caverns and goblins – but, having said that, I think the stakes need to start low in order for characters to feel a greater sense of accomplishment later.
If you’ve spent your low levels saving small villages, and clearing Farmer Maggot’s crops for a bagfull of gold, it’s all the more fulfilling and awesome when you’re 10th level and you’re saving the whole continent.
To compromise, I generally run the players through the low levels fairly quickly so it doesn’t get tiresome, but nevertheless I think there needs to be that arc – when you’re saving the world from level one to level 20, saving the world gets old, fast. Where’s the growth?
Wow, there’s a lot of talk about violently ejecting Brett. I think these people are missing that he’s not just a gaming buddy you see once a month, he’s Sam’s best friend, and Sam knows that he just likes bitching.
That said, maybe Brett could wait until later than the first roll of the campaign before going off.