Dungeon Run: Doot Doot
Chapter: Comics, Season Five
Hm. What’s that about?
Thanks for your patience, everyone. Life is kicking me like I owe it money right now.
Comments are closed.
/>
/>
Hm. What’s that about?
Thanks for your patience, everyone. Life is kicking me like I owe it money right now.
Comments are closed.
Hover Text: Doot Doot
Dun dun DUNNNNN!!!
Dang, you beat me to it. 🙂
I want to meet Dove’s brother….badly. Is that wrong?
Isn’t his brother that giant bro jerk that was so terrible to them as well?
nah that was a cousin
Grey is Dove’s cousin.
What a tweest!
As a Magic player, I just found Dove to be even more infuriating then usual. Quite honestly, I’m astounded that is even possible.
Being an infuriating (insert swear of choice here)? That’s easy
Pulling off a surprise Dictate of the Twin Gods while using Spite of Mogis on my own Boros Reckoner to burn my enemy for 20 life? That takes skill.
I wouldn’t know: I just used a Sliver deck or a Wyrm deck. why?
…because they were my favorite.
of COURSE he would be the kind of douche that uses one of those stupid headsets…
I use a bluetooth headset. I hardly consider myself a douche. It’s a useful tool, particularly while taking a call during my commute.
I think what Logan means to say is that he finds people who use Bluetooth headsets to look slightly ludicrous. And that many Bluetooth headset users do not seem to understand that their device is still, essentially, a phone; it annoys others if you hold your “bluetooth-headset” conversations where it’s normally inappropriate to hold phone conversations.
Evilbob got it in one. holding up your phone at least in public lets folks know “hey I’m on the phone.”
walking around talking to yourself just looks silly.
So…. the question is, was he lying? I get the feeling he wasn’t, actually. Which… kind of brings up a question. Would someone swap Dove’s die with a loaded variant to try and get his ass gone? If so, WHO? Or was he just lucky?
Also, how many people have a reason to hate Sam? Besides Grey, cause I REALLY doubt that was Grey in the car. I’d almost think Larry for some reason, but nah. Maybe Tatiana, the Critalicious lady who Amy tricked into leaving? I could see that, actually
I don’t think it is anyone we’ve met. I’m thinking it might be another game store owner who has lost business to Sam. It would make sense that Dove would know him then.
I was thinking rather Tatiana or someone other store owner where we see something where Sam Family would get involved.
Tatiana doesn’t strike me as the kind of person who drives around mysteriously in limos and calls Phillip “Mr Dove”.
Hey guys? Don’t forget that it’s not really Sam’s (or if it is, it wasn’t always) store. When/if he inherited the store with all its privileges and allies, he’s probably inherited the grudges against it as well.
My bet is Krampus. Enemy of my enemy’s ally is my friend, that sorta deal.
Might be reading too much into this, but generally, giving an elaborate sidestep (“I never cheat”) instead of saying yes or no is a “tell” that someone is lying. I’m not convinced it was legit.
Probably. But all readers will naturally be more inclined to side with Sam and to be biased against Mr. Dove here, no matter the case, anyway.
people who have been proven to be A: sexist, B: elitist and C: a total asshole are generally consistent. besides, dove’s done things up to and including getting sam and his date denied from a restaurant, so he’s a dick both in-game and out.
…Why does Dove think Magic requires no skill? I mean, while I’m an L5R player at heart, I can understand that -any- CCG requires some skill to build a good deck and to know what to play and when. And then there is dealing with the meta. Arguably, it requires just as much skill as any RPG, as you can get doomed by a bad roll on your part or a lucky roll on your opponent’s as easily as a bad draw in a card game. Perhaps it’s the fact that you can’t manipulate your opponent to your advantage in a card game as easily as you can in a card game that Dove thinks it’s for peasants.
Why does Dove think it takes no skill? Probably because he sucks at it.
ditto, Sun
Frankly I think Dove just lied flat out, he did use loaded dice and he did cheat. We’ve also seen him cheat in the past so that proves he is in fact lying. Recall if you will the restaurant where he did not have a reservation and used his influence to get in and cheat a certain someone out of their reservation for their first date. That was in point of fact cheating to get his way and snub someone he believed was better then him by making himself look better than them. Then you had the whole issue where he found out Dallas Noble was female and used his influence to crash Dead Iron. He pushed his outdated, and outmoded beliefs onto the public eye or rather cheated and crashed the game with his influence rather than leaving it to its own merits simply because she was a woman. The little boy known as Dove needs to crash and burn in a serious way and lose that influence because he isn’t even using it right. Peter Parker learned with the death of his uncle that with great power comes great responsibility. However, Dove abuses great power and throws away the responsibility for what havoc he reeks. When you flaunt your power and abuse others with it eventually per the rules of karma you will always end up paying for it.
Or do you just WANT him to have cheated so badly that you’ll invent literally any justification to continue thinking so?
Entire dungeon run, his die never rolled below an 18. If he’s not cheating, I’ll eat my hat.
Seriously, I have a hat.
We never *saw* him roll below an 18 – big difference. Plus, his character was probably so unbalanced that he didn’t need to roll that well anyway. Yeah, it is a bit disconcerting that he rolled so well, but it could happen.
Might be reading too much into this, but generally, giving an elaborate sidestep (“I never cheatâ€) instead of saying yes or no is a “tell†that someone is lying. I’m not convinced it was legit.
We also never saw him fail an action, and that’s saying a lot. That first lava trap must have had a high save DC, since it killed 8 total dungeon runners, he aced that, then his next action involved a knowledge check, an attack roll, and some sort of acrobatic spell technique. Then, he not only navigated the maze, he did so stealthily, quite a trick for a wizard, especially when the ranger is the one out for your blood. After that, he read more or less all of his die rolls out loud, nothing below a 19. Now, I admit it’s possible he’s not cheating, but my money’s still on illegal dice.
True we do dislike him to make up stories to discredit him – however in this case we don’t need to because he’s a rude arrogant *cheater*, as his chaffeur will find out to their displeasure.
Arious, abuse of power and manipulating others is not cheating. It’s just the abuse of power and manipulating others. While it may be against the rules of common courtesy and decency to do such things, it’s still legal and fine. Plus, sometimes these things can, theoretically, be used for good, but it’s just that good characters often have too many scruples to do such things. That’s why the Rokugani have the Scorpion, after all.
Personally, I’d love to find out that he cheated. He’s a complete, irredeemable not-at-all-magnificent bastard and I want to see him get his comeuppance. But honestly? Brian’s been throwing us curve balls lately, and the whole loaded dice question seems more and more like a red herring.
its not that alone, its a sign of bigger things, when a person does one thing they are more likely to do the other. Not only that but he looks down on this entire group in such a way that he would see using illegal dice as not cheating but as receiving his just rewards that he is entitled to instead of cheating. Like I said it’s all one piece in this case his attitude shows the signs of the cheater.
oh and the manipulations I was speaking of were not in game but with society in general which is frowned upon and is in most cases illegal.
I feel a more accurate ring for his cell would be: “Douche Douche”
This is either an Ocean’s 11, or an Illuminati situation.
MtG definitely requires skill. An inexperienced player playing a tier-1 deck will lose more than 50% of the time to an expert playing a second tier deck and maybe even a third tier deck if the tier-1 deck is based on a complicated strategy.
meant to reply to https://d20monkey.com/2014/09/11/dungeon-run-doot-doot/comment-page-1/#comment-70318
“I am the best. I never cheat…
…I merely do what is necessary to ensure my victory.”
Damn I can’t remember where that come from… but I’m pretty sure it was used in a story to justify cheating as an “it’s not cheating a long as I don’t get caught/ as long as I win” excuse…
Really? Because I just made that up on the spot xD
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PyrrhicVictory
Wait, let’s just recap:
– Dove lost the RPG because Dallas came up with a good strategy and rolled a 20 with Dove’s d20.
– She made a comment that it was his dice, which he took to be implying that his dice were dodgy.
– Having already been warned that personal attacks were not allowed, he personally attacked both player and GM, and was banned for doing so.
Whether or not he actually cheated doesn’t change anything in the current situation – game result is the same, douchebag is the same, banning is the same. He’s just using the inferred accusation as justification to feel righteous in losing.
Him thinking her comment implied he had loaded dice screams guilty conscience. I’m with Dallas, if I roll something, good or not, I’d rather roll it with my own dice, it just feels better, and doesn’t feel like as much of a victory if it’s another’s dice.
Personally I think Dove is telling the truth because of just how arrogant he is. Yes he is an overbearing misogynistic bigot who would happily attempt to bully and rules-lawyer their way into getting what they want, but I don’t think he’d stoop to actual physical cheating, as it would negate his deep-seated belief that he is “the best”.
I don’t believe that Dove cheated either. In fiction, the very best villains always have lines they don’t cross; it gives them complexity to their characters. And Dove, as deeply as he drinks from the cup of bile, is a good villain. I hope to see more of him, and look forward to a very satisfying end to him involving a cheese grater and lemon juice.
Exactly. Lawful Evil villains are best villains. I mean, look at the most memorable villains in comic books. Most of them would fall into the LE category, instead of the CE, with a few special exceptions (like the Joker). It’s easier to understand what drives a lawful evil villain and they often may blur the line between good and evil, such as with Magneto or more recent interpretations of Two-Face.
Every time we see Dove’s d20 get rolled in this arc, it comes up a 19 or 20. Extremely suspicious imo. I think he’s using a loaded die and his bluster is a bluff. People who are so convinced that they’re the best tend to have fragile enough egos that they can’t handle losing and take measures to ensure that that never happens.
Even if he wasn’t cheating, it says a lot about his “good strategy” if he needs to roll that many 19’s and 20’s to survive. As someone who has played Pathfinder organized play and a LOT of D&D-related things (and, you know, D&D itself), I find that the best builds and abilities tend to be things that minimize how much you rely on chance to win.
For instance, one of my favorite characters in Pathfinder organized play was a support Fighter/Monk who literally just gave his allies huge +attack and +AC bonuses. The only way he could fail to give them SOME of these large bonuses was if he rolled a ‘1’; otherwise, he mostly stood beside them, moved into flanking position and provided Luck bonuses to AC. (It helped that he could use Dirty Trick maneuvers and such, but still.) This meant that he was essentially an enabler, giving his allies (such as rogues, who are notoriously awful at hitting things) extra attack bonuses to ensure they hit the enemy, minimizing the possibility of them failing due to a bad roll. Combined with a Cleric friend that had the ability to force allies to roll 11’s and we usually steamrolled over Pathfinder Society content.
And now I’m going to have to read the whole comic right from day 1 to try and figure out who is in the car. Dirty work but someone’s got to do it 😉
Like I needed another reason to hate Dove. Peasant’s Game!!! We will see what my Green Black Ramp deck has to say about that. Arrogant bastard.
Actually, the below was meant to go up here. Either I misclicked or a small glitch has occurred. Anyway, heard that, red / green cheese deck, fun to be using old defunct technology that could still burn a player to the ground even now.
Any gamer who thinks Magic requires no real skill is a silly, silly person with bad and dumb opinions. Hate the game if it is not your cup of pekoe black, sure, but to argue it takes no skill just shows how clueless Dove really is.
I still have a red / green cheese deck I used to play in the late nineties. I think half the cards in it are banned and the rest are unusable because you need to have their current-era equivalents, but I kind of like the thought of wandering around with the Magic deck equivalent of a Dwemer Centurion. 😀
My entire life I’ve waited for someone to pull up to me in a limo, roll down the window and say, “Get in, Phillip.”
And I’d reply, “My name isn’t Phillip.”
And they’d say, “Whatever, you’ll do.”
Left field theory with zilch for grounding, but it’d be awesome if Limo Guy was the crossover point between the Sam stuff and Brett’s. Can’t you imagine Dove working for some mythical entity displaced or displeased by Mr. Tucker?
If that was the case it would probably be the Krampus, I’ve said before it would explain a lot if Dove turned out to be his son 😉
Krampus is just the other side of the Santa/Christmas coin. Brett wrenched Krampus from Klaus’s control (who was making Krampus take even the good kids, which is against what he does), so Krampus has absolutely nothing against Brett.
Now, as the poster beneath me said, Klaus, though…. but it seemed that Dove knew who was in the car. So probably not Klaus.
Plus, isn’t Klaus kinda bound up in the North Pole?
He is, but he keeps possessing people.
I like this theory.
Could mean the setup for a Klaus/Dove team up. That’ll be disturbing…
It can also be argued that Dove didn’t really answer the question he was asked.
“Did you use illegal dice?”: An objective question, requiring only a yes or no.
“I never cheat.”: A subjective response, as Dove’s concept of cheating may not prevent him from using dice that give him some form of advantage, even if they are illegal.
By providing the subjective answer, he allows the questioner to draw the connection that “never cheat” incorporates not using “illegal dice,” even though Dove never explicitly stated that the dice he used are not illegal.
That’s some interesting mental gymnastics you’re doing there. I’d think most people would consider “I never cheat” to be a fairly objective answer. And using illegal dice would certainly qualify as cheating.
More importantly, I think Dove takes gaming too seriously to stoop to cheating. As other’s have said, Dove is a Lawful Evil Rules Lawyer – he’ll manipulate a situation and exploit every loophole to his advantage, but he’ll never out-right cheat. Look at how he exploded when Dallas almost tangentially accused him of cheating.
Also, look at the first half of his response: “I am the best.” Yes, maybe he could consider using rigged dice to be just another tactic for an “elite gamer” like himself, I don’t think so. If you have to cheat to win, it doesn’t prove anything. And if Dove cares about anything, it’s proving that he’s the best.
Sorry, that got a bit long.
Bull. Plenty of people believe that it’s not cheating if you don’t get caught, or if it’s “for a good cause” (and like he seriously doesn’t think of himself as that). That kind of response is a classic dodge, and any mental gymnastics going on would be squarely within Phil’s dome if true. Are you going to claim that he isn’t badly deluded?
And after I clicked on “Post Comment,” something just came to mind regarding the identity of the limo resident. Assuming Dove has just left, who could know this quickly what happened, unless he has already had the time to post his screed against the shop and tournament, and this person is one of Dove’s “Legion?”
I *really* want to see Brett come back with his Naughty List as *proof* of Dove’s cheating.
Ya know, after seeing Dove use one of those clip things, I’m suddenly reminded of a quote from Dr.Cox “Ya know, I believe people who use these things deserve that someone start throwing rocks at them. It’s a phone for a reason, not a stupid clip on that makes you appear like the worlds bigger tosser, which ironically you are.”
Ok, the “arm up holding phone” pose? It can get awkward after a while. Especially if walking at the same time, on a sidewalk where you might need maneuverability and a lack of “elbows jutting out.”
As long as you remember that people don’t know you’re not talking to them, and don’t snark when they’re confused “excuse me, I’m on the phone.” Well yeah, I see that NOW, but I thought you were asking me a question. For those tossers, gather the rocks.
No! No revenge, dammit! You lose! You get nothing! Good day, sir!
Did Dove steal Fizzy Lifting Drinks, now, too?
He’s already got plenty of hot air to keep him afloat.
I believe that Dove was telling the truth, according to his point of view. An “elite” player does what ever it takes to win and if that means using loaded dice then so be it. As a rules lawyer Dove would justify it by telling himself there is no rule against using loaded dice ipso facto the dice were not illegal. After all it was Dove that first brought up the idea that he was cheating by denying that he was. In my line of work we have a saying, “if a person denies a charge that was never made then they are probably guilty.”
That’s the best argument for him having cheated I have seen. I was starting to side with the “He’s to arrogant to cheat†arguments, which have merit. I noticed he did that but I didn’t give it enough attention.
Edit: My original post was supposed to be a reply to this comment. Sorry for the double post but I didn’t think it made proper sense as it was, and didn’t see another way to edit it.
>>In my line of work we have a saying, “if a person denies a charge that was never made then they are probably guilty.â€
Or as Shakespeare said “I think you doth protest too much.”
*tweet* Misuse of Shakespearean language in a quoted attribution. Flag on the play, 15 yard penalty.
That line, in its quoted context, is the Queen responding with her opinion that a character in the play is promising more than she can deliver. The character promises to never remarry if her husband dies, which the queen thinks is a bit much, using the Shakespearean meaning of “protest” to mean “promise.”
While language and meanings have changed, using the line as a referenced quote, with the modern meaning of “protest,” indicates a lack of knowledge of the surrounding context of the line.
Player Queen:
Both here and hence pursue me lasting strife,
If once I be a widow, ever I be a wife!
Player King:
‘Tis deeply sworn. Sweet, leave me here a while,
My spirits grow dull, and fain I would beguile
The tedious day with sleep.
Player Queen:
Sleep rock thy brain,
And never come mischance between us twain!
Hamlet:
Madam, how like you this play?
Queen:
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
That’s the best argument for him having cheated I have seen. I was starting to side with the “He’s to arrogant to cheat” arguments, which have merit. I noticed he did that but didn’t give it enough attention.
I think Dove said what he did about MtG cause he has never won at magic and can not make the decks he wants within the rules
The plot thickens… *twiddles goatee*
Evil Goatee of Amazing is Evil. my hat to you friend.
oh god, you know what I just realized? Dove is Todd from Code Monkeys.
….except not nearly as cool, and THAT’S saying something!
I have a theory: when Dove was young he played a game of DnD with his ‘friends’ and lost, he went crying to his parents and they bought loaded dice and gave them to him, saying these were magic/lucky dice that never miss, and for the years that followed he believed them as he couldnt roll under 19.
i think thats a feasable theory dont you?
by the way im not related to the Logan above me, its just very coincidental that i posted right after him.
hey its all good! we logans gotta make the world go round. it is my real name, and yes, my mom was a huge goddamn xmen nerd….
so, logan the 5 year combat medic, with 3 artificial joints, and spinal reinforcements. what a strange coincidental world this is…I need a drink.
He only as access to people who believe in Santa, I don’t think Dove believe in much except maybe his own righteousness
Oops, that was meant as a reply to Jaeden about Brett proving Dove’s culpability with the Naughty list
Someone refresh my memory, is Klaus locked away? It’s one of the most common moves in the villain handbook to attack your enemy through those closest to him. i could see Klaus exploiting Brett’s absence to take out one of his trusted friends.
Yeah my first thought was evil santa as well.
I honestly cant recall any other major antagonists they have.
What if it’s Mr. Belvedere?
Well of course he cheated.
I dont care how good you are at table top games the dice are never that lucky.
…at the end of this, I still think he cheated.