I don’t think he’s being mean, but I do think he’s being a bit harsher than is normal (based on how he’s run things in the past). Especially given how everyone’s gone out of their way to make Carlos feel welcome.
I’m going to put the blame for that on a combination of pain and his meds.
Actually, I think that this is because everyone is either A) out of practice. or B) still nervous about a new group. These things can cause mistakes. I’m with a gaming group and we’re playing premade modules, one of them set us against a black dragon at LEVEL ONE. And our only help was a sword enchanted with dragon’s bane that no one in the party had proficiency to use. Sometimes, campaigns HAVE to start off on a rough note to help reinforce the importance of events.
Because yeah, bad rolls aside, a perception check could probably have noticed the trap and he didn’t bother to make one. They’re going into a known stronghold area of a guy that is politically powerful and that admittedly does not have patrols by the proper authorities. Surprising that they didn’t already ‘find’ a trap or two.
That’s why heroes usually face incompetent villains. Because when the bad guys are efficient the heroes get … wrecked.
Okay the bad guys here also got lucky, they got a free round, killed a caster, second caster rolled bad and got almost killed, which leave the rest of the party with only hand to hand against three archers. The tripwire trap is still an excellent idea. If I had been in charge of this ambush I would have made sure that the trap also target behind the advancing enemy, putting one fighter out of commission with ease is good, downing all the party is better.
I like subtle traps, like the crushing wall from Baldur’s gate 2. I actually had my goblin thief install one in his hideaway, along with things like an “easy to lockpick door” which allowed a giant spike to nail people to the ceiling once it was opened… I am dissapointed that nobody ever tried to kill me in my sleep, it would have been fun to watch.
I only use incompetent villains when the race is of low intelligence. If the bad guys have brain cells to rub together, they can be quite terrifying. 🙂 And I think that’s perfectly fine.
There is also the fact that these are established characters (barring the new guy) in a world they already know is dangerous and wrought with peril – I think this encounter is a perfectly legitimate way of reinforcing that right out the gate. may latest campaign killed off half the characters in very quick order at its very beginning, and so far its been my one of my most ‘successful’ (everyone shows up every week, and have invested quite heavily in both the characters that survived, and the new ones they had to make to join the group a second time, with very little effort on my part to have to try and keep them engaged – they actually breath a sigh of relief when they manage to out think and outsmart their opponents, and cringe at the start of combat, unless it was set up to their advantage beforehand. So much fun to DM.)
annnd here come the darts! …or Log. Hammer? Swinging blades? That one trap from Home Alone involving the buckets? Boulder Trap? Rabid squirrels with ballistic knives? What did he activate; the suspense is killing me?!
Shame on you,you forgot the classic Pitfall. That would be a good one here since the enemys are all use range weapon. Either its that or ,yes, a boulder trap. 🙂
my guess is explosives of some sort. if, on the other hand, Sam is NOT trying to wipe them out, its likely to be a crossbow tied to a string (or cluster of crossbows, if they had the time… a volley of bolts can be quite an effective softener for the first person who charges up the corridor) that they set up out here in advance knowing they were setting up this ambush.
So I’m voting for the crossbows, because Sam doesn’t seem to have any reason to set them up to fail, I think this is just showing his personal growth as a DM, and his ability to judge his players characters and what can really challenge them – If he didnt think they could handle it, he wouldn’t have thrown it at them quite like this, even with a point to make about the cloak and dagger (emphasis on dagger perhaps?) style of play they might come to expect from the rest of the game.
Get wrecked, these bad guys are smart and actually planned out a solid ambush.
Honestly, I would have turned tail and run here – the DM is clearly pushing a more realistic fight than average here, and in reality, a well prepared ambush generally works. That said, this also being a story, I expect the remaining half of the Dwarf to survive because of plot armour.
Time to get the hell out of dodge, methinks. Breck is out, Kel’Fazat is on the ropes, and it looks like Hale is about to go down, too.
I wonder if Brett’s absence from gaming has softened his edge; as the party rogue one would expect him to be sneaking ahead once they were past the areas patrolled by the guards to spot ambushes and traps.
(I say this as a member of a party that usually also just blunders into these kinds of fights in our Pathfinder game…)
While this looks like it’s leading up to a TPK, I don’t think that’s actually likely. I think this might be a push like a story hook, to allow Sam to introduce an NPC that will save the party’s collective asses and then act as a guide/story driver.
Depending on what this trap is, this is an entirely legitimate CR2 encounter so far, it might get cranked up to a CR 3. 3 CR 1/3 level 1 warriors plus a trap, I’m guessing falling rocks that will deal some damage and make that difficult terrain.
I feel like we’re all overlooking something: the world of the dead is a big part of this setting. Maybe this TPK is really just the start of the “real” game. Act One of the campaign is to escape the Dead, Act Two is to stop the extra-dimensional demon cult thing, Act Three is to deal with the repercussions of Act One. After all, the Mother is jealous of her children…
Sam is too seasoned a GM to not know what he’s doing. He showed no remorse when Jeanie’s character died and he didn’t even ask for her character sheet. Besides, he probably planned this encounter out without being under the influence of pain pills; it’s not his fault how the dice have fallen so far.
You mean, an enchantment to force them to lower their guards and then dropping all manner of oozes and Prismatic Sprays on them? You’re brilliant! And so evil!
I’m heavy into traps myself, I mean I really know them and I have entire books dedicated to making and putting them together for campaigns so that their hidden and hard to find. I’ll even be the first to say that traps can be very handy at times. Now having said that this early on is it really a good thing to hit a group that’s more than half newbie with this much trap? But on the other hand, they are in a mine, and its being used by a secretive and evil cult so traps are a given already. and no trad that goes off in this manner is a good trap for those whom think something good is about to happen. Then again I’ve had traps misfire, and when they happens their is a large chance it could go off on the people who set it in some way, shape, or form. Now having said all this I like the simple trap which looks like its helping but in the long run turns into death in a hand basket and everything goes from bad to worse then straight to on my god kill me now, it might just hurt a little less than the half of the trap I’ve already been hit with!!! In either case in some ways this situation looks a little, just a little heavy handed, but i think you can still make it work and after all they did technically set off everything that’s gone down with them. Yes, it seems to me that the gods of Karthun are neck deep in blood today, either that or a certain DM (GM) is really feeling the meds and went on a killing spree by pure chance…
I do have one question though, since its a wire their is a chance it can be missed, so where was the roll to see if it was actually hit as he was running at the enemy? Their is always a chance with such traps that they’ll miss, lord knows I’ve had that happen, nothing more annoying. Then again that just means when someone does hit the trip wire its worse for everyone that missed it….
In previous stories, Brian doesn’t show every roll. So we don’t know if Sam rolled here, but even if he did, it might be not shown for the sake of storytelling fluidity.
You’re telling me he actually has miniatures that are extremely appropriate to the situation? That’s suspending disbelief way too much!
Where’s the orc barbarian to represent the dwarf? Where’s the goblins to represent the bandit archers? Where’s the one bandit archer to represent the knight, and you’re using him for that since you don’t have enough of them to represent the actual bandit archers! And where is the random plastic army soldier/or Space Marine/or chess piece for when you’ve run out of actual miniatures?
See, I’ve been on heavy pain meds, and seen people on them as well. I’ve never seen someone get ‘grudgy’ or vindictive… they get loopy. I think currently this is probably a ‘supposed to lose’ type of fight.
Now, if the trap flings a horse wearing a bowler at them that starts talking and wants hugs, THAT I would attribute to the pain medication. Or pelicans that are somehow not birds because they aren’t wearing pants, or he asks them if they have their frogs ready for the incoming bear…
All those are based on conversations I’ve been in with people on pain medication.
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HOVER-TEXT: I hope this doesn’t trip them up. TRIP THEM UP, GUYS! GUYS! TRIP THEM UP!
I don’t get it. 😀
Just kidding. I thought it was pretty punny.
Sam is being mean. 🙁
I think he’s doing just fine. The group’s not prepared, which is a bad thing at lower levels.
But what if the trap takes out the three villains?
I don’t think he’s being mean, but I do think he’s being a bit harsher than is normal (based on how he’s run things in the past). Especially given how everyone’s gone out of their way to make Carlos feel welcome.
I’m going to put the blame for that on a combination of pain and his meds.
Actually, I think that this is because everyone is either A) out of practice. or B) still nervous about a new group. These things can cause mistakes. I’m with a gaming group and we’re playing premade modules, one of them set us against a black dragon at LEVEL ONE. And our only help was a sword enchanted with dragon’s bane that no one in the party had proficiency to use. Sometimes, campaigns HAVE to start off on a rough note to help reinforce the importance of events.
Because yeah, bad rolls aside, a perception check could probably have noticed the trap and he didn’t bother to make one. They’re going into a known stronghold area of a guy that is politically powerful and that admittedly does not have patrols by the proper authorities. Surprising that they didn’t already ‘find’ a trap or two.
Wow, first encounter and he’s doing all this? Hmm
That’s what I’m thinking…
Wow… That’s just…. Damn.
I love the second panel so freaking much.
Me too.
Pre-Gen Con TPK? Intriguing. See you there!
Man Sam is being a Grudgy bitch! I LOVE IT!
That’s why heroes usually face incompetent villains. Because when the bad guys are efficient the heroes get … wrecked.
Okay the bad guys here also got lucky, they got a free round, killed a caster, second caster rolled bad and got almost killed, which leave the rest of the party with only hand to hand against three archers. The tripwire trap is still an excellent idea. If I had been in charge of this ambush I would have made sure that the trap also target behind the advancing enemy, putting one fighter out of commission with ease is good, downing all the party is better.
I like subtle traps, like the crushing wall from Baldur’s gate 2. I actually had my goblin thief install one in his hideaway, along with things like an “easy to lockpick door” which allowed a giant spike to nail people to the ceiling once it was opened… I am dissapointed that nobody ever tried to kill me in my sleep, it would have been fun to watch.
I only use incompetent villains when the race is of low intelligence. If the bad guys have brain cells to rub together, they can be quite terrifying. 🙂 And I think that’s perfectly fine.
And that is why I like Tucker’s Kobolds so much. Check out http://www.tuckerskobolds.com/ for the original article that was in Dragon magazine
That article is really what started my love of kobolds.
There is also the fact that these are established characters (barring the new guy) in a world they already know is dangerous and wrought with peril – I think this encounter is a perfectly legitimate way of reinforcing that right out the gate. may latest campaign killed off half the characters in very quick order at its very beginning, and so far its been my one of my most ‘successful’ (everyone shows up every week, and have invested quite heavily in both the characters that survived, and the new ones they had to make to join the group a second time, with very little effort on my part to have to try and keep them engaged – they actually breath a sigh of relief when they manage to out think and outsmart their opponents, and cringe at the start of combat, unless it was set up to their advantage beforehand. So much fun to DM.)
annnd here come the darts! …or Log. Hammer? Swinging blades? That one trap from Home Alone involving the buckets? Boulder Trap? Rabid squirrels with ballistic knives? What did he activate; the suspense is killing me?!
Shame on you,you forgot the classic Pitfall. That would be a good one here since the enemys are all use range weapon. Either its that or ,yes, a boulder trap. 🙂
Pit Traps are nice, but you got to have something wait down there for them. like rats, or a zombie. you know, keep it interesting.
My personal favourite is a sheer drop onto a Gelatinous Cube precisely the size of the bottom of the pit trap.
Aged cheese stored in used shoes under skunk lair spray.
my guess is explosives of some sort. if, on the other hand, Sam is NOT trying to wipe them out, its likely to be a crossbow tied to a string (or cluster of crossbows, if they had the time… a volley of bolts can be quite an effective softener for the first person who charges up the corridor) that they set up out here in advance knowing they were setting up this ambush.
So I’m voting for the crossbows, because Sam doesn’t seem to have any reason to set them up to fail, I think this is just showing his personal growth as a DM, and his ability to judge his players characters and what can really challenge them – If he didnt think they could handle it, he wouldn’t have thrown it at them quite like this, even with a point to make about the cloak and dagger (emphasis on dagger perhaps?) style of play they might come to expect from the rest of the game.
Make them watch Ishtar on an endless loop. There are acts in war that are just too cruel.
Oh…
I just realized I need waaaaay more traps in my campaign.
Thank you! <3
Don’t freak out Carlos, this has been all sorts of bad since the beginning.
Are we sure he didnt go evil sam again?
I think it may turn out to be less Evil Sam, more Impaired Judgment Due to Painkillers Sam
I hate to be the one to say it, but… TPW
Is it only me who loves where all of this is heading?
I’m taking notes on this with a very eager grin on my face.
This really makes me want some Karthun minis.
Get wrecked, these bad guys are smart and actually planned out a solid ambush.
Honestly, I would have turned tail and run here – the DM is clearly pushing a more realistic fight than average here, and in reality, a well prepared ambush generally works. That said, this also being a story, I expect the remaining half of the Dwarf to survive because of plot armour.
Time to get the hell out of dodge, methinks. Breck is out, Kel’Fazat is on the ropes, and it looks like Hale is about to go down, too.
I wonder if Brett’s absence from gaming has softened his edge; as the party rogue one would expect him to be sneaking ahead once they were past the areas patrolled by the guards to spot ambushes and traps.
(I say this as a member of a party that usually also just blunders into these kinds of fights in our Pathfinder game…)
*blank stare*
Daaaaaaaaamn…either the party is rusty in their RPG skills or Sam is feeling a little TOO numb from those painkillers. Yikes!
you inspired me to commit an outrage: http://abstractlabor.blogspot.com/2015/07/karthun-dad-jokes.html
Looks like this will be a total party wipe. I’m guessing Sam’s got the next leg of the adventure in the Afterlife. Just As Planned.
TPK on the first encounter? Seeming more and more likely.
TPK! TPK! TPK!
TPK!
While this looks like it’s leading up to a TPK, I don’t think that’s actually likely. I think this might be a push like a story hook, to allow Sam to introduce an NPC that will save the party’s collective asses and then act as a guide/story driver.
Depending on what this trap is, this is an entirely legitimate CR2 encounter so far, it might get cranked up to a CR 3. 3 CR 1/3 level 1 warriors plus a trap, I’m guessing falling rocks that will deal some damage and make that difficult terrain.
Level 2 party, ambushed but had the numeric advantage. Foes using range and terrain advantage. This is an even fight not a TPK in the making.
This is going about as well as my last Pathfinder session.
So this’ll be the story arc about TPKs & how they mess-up campaigns
I feel like we’re all overlooking something: the world of the dead is a big part of this setting. Maybe this TPK is really just the start of the “real” game. Act One of the campaign is to escape the Dead, Act Two is to stop the extra-dimensional demon cult thing, Act Three is to deal with the repercussions of Act One. After all, the Mother is jealous of her children…
Sam is too seasoned a GM to not know what he’s doing. He showed no remorse when Jeanie’s character died and he didn’t even ask for her character sheet. Besides, he probably planned this encounter out without being under the influence of pain pills; it’s not his fault how the dice have fallen so far.
öhm…maybe ist not a bad trap.
..it could be a trap of Happiness making it rain Gumdrops and Rainbows.
..yeah.
You mean, an enchantment to force them to lower their guards and then dropping all manner of oozes and Prismatic Sprays on them? You’re brilliant! And so evil!
I’m heavy into traps myself, I mean I really know them and I have entire books dedicated to making and putting them together for campaigns so that their hidden and hard to find. I’ll even be the first to say that traps can be very handy at times. Now having said that this early on is it really a good thing to hit a group that’s more than half newbie with this much trap? But on the other hand, they are in a mine, and its being used by a secretive and evil cult so traps are a given already. and no trad that goes off in this manner is a good trap for those whom think something good is about to happen. Then again I’ve had traps misfire, and when they happens their is a large chance it could go off on the people who set it in some way, shape, or form. Now having said all this I like the simple trap which looks like its helping but in the long run turns into death in a hand basket and everything goes from bad to worse then straight to on my god kill me now, it might just hurt a little less than the half of the trap I’ve already been hit with!!! In either case in some ways this situation looks a little, just a little heavy handed, but i think you can still make it work and after all they did technically set off everything that’s gone down with them. Yes, it seems to me that the gods of Karthun are neck deep in blood today, either that or a certain DM (GM) is really feeling the meds and went on a killing spree by pure chance…
I do have one question though, since its a wire their is a chance it can be missed, so where was the roll to see if it was actually hit as he was running at the enemy? Their is always a chance with such traps that they’ll miss, lord knows I’ve had that happen, nothing more annoying. Then again that just means when someone does hit the trip wire its worse for everyone that missed it….
In previous stories, Brian doesn’t show every roll. So we don’t know if Sam rolled here, but even if he did, it might be not shown for the sake of storytelling fluidity.
Tripwires are generally placed high enough that you’re only going to step over them deliberately.
Wait, wait wait…
You’re telling me he actually has miniatures that are extremely appropriate to the situation? That’s suspending disbelief way too much!
Where’s the orc barbarian to represent the dwarf? Where’s the goblins to represent the bandit archers? Where’s the one bandit archer to represent the knight, and you’re using him for that since you don’t have enough of them to represent the actual bandit archers! And where is the random plastic army soldier/or Space Marine/or chess piece for when you’ve run out of actual miniatures?
Oh right, his dad owns a game store… cheater.
See, I’ve been on heavy pain meds, and seen people on them as well. I’ve never seen someone get ‘grudgy’ or vindictive… they get loopy. I think currently this is probably a ‘supposed to lose’ type of fight.
Now, if the trap flings a horse wearing a bowler at them that starts talking and wants hugs, THAT I would attribute to the pain medication. Or pelicans that are somehow not birds because they aren’t wearing pants, or he asks them if they have their frogs ready for the incoming bear…
All those are based on conversations I’ve been in with people on pain medication.
Well that isn’t good. Best case, it’s just an alarm trap, though.